Memo To Christians With Artistic Gifts

Posted by Chris L on Jan 21st, 2008
2008
Jan 21

Recently discovered document, from backstage at the REDACTED show.

_____________________

TO: “Christians” with Artistic Gifts
RE: Success and Doing Your Best

It has come to our attention that you are employed in the world of entertainment. While this, alone, should disqualify you from the book of life, since you claim the title “Christian”, please realize that we will be watching you like a hawk. At some point, you will fail, and when you do, you will get a foretaste of what your experience will be like in hell, as we will be the hands and feet of God to deliver it to you. So please, keep in mind the following:

1) If you are ever interviewed, our skepticism of the press will vanish to be replaced with an “absence detector”, which identifies anything and everything you never said in that interview. Even if you DID say what didn’t get printed, it does not matter - you must not have said it forcefully enough, or else they would have printed it.

2) If you are involved in an artistic venture that requires dancing, you are going to hell. Unless you are encased in a full-body cast, we will characterize your performance as “writhing around” and “fanny shaking” and “pelvic thrusting”. Fanny-shaking is of the devil.

3) If you’re a woman, it doesn’t matter if you’re wearing a burkha. Your dress will always be called ‘immodest’, and characterized as “fleshly” or “worldly”. Deal with it.

4) If you’re an actor, you’d best marry another actor and ONLY perform with that person. Otherwise, do not take any part which requires you to so much as hold hands with another actor. If you do so, be prepared for an onslaught of criticism for your cavalier attitude toward sexuality.

5) If you are required to travel as part of your work, please realize that - unless you travel back to your home church EVERY week - we will exoriate you for your lack of faithfulness in attending your local church. NOTE: If you have support from your local church community while you’re on the road, that doesn’t mean you’ll get a free pass. We’ll just criticize you because of all of those people who can’t afford such nicities.

6) DO NOT, by any means, attain any level of ‘success‘. If you do, it will be evidence of your carnality and worldliness, which we will roast you for. If you are successful, that is a sign that you’re not being persecuted, and, therefore, not a Christian. Your best bet is to suck enough to prevent success, but not so much that your tithe won’t pay for the new educational wing at your “church”. Remember - the tallest blade of grass is always the one that gets cut down first.

7) If you do not mention “Jesus” (”God” doesn’t count) at every available opportunity, we will trumpet this as evidence of your fleshly, worldly motivations and your selling out on the altar of worldly success. We will thump our breasts to show what an awful hypocrite you are!

8) If you are a painter, we’d best not find any paintings of things outside of Christianity (or, worse yet, which depict anything apart from a modernist or romantic view of the Biblical account). If we can construe something to be anti-Christian, we will, and we will blame you.

9) If you are a singer, every song had best mention “Jesus” (not “God”), or you’re a worldly sell-out.

10) If you are an actor, never play the part of a villan or do anything that would be a sin. Additionally, do not ever act in a movie that gets a rating of PG or higher (unless it is a semi-realistic portrayal of the crucifixion, in which case we will only criticize you for being a Catholic instead of being a Christian). We may give you a pass, though, if you act in poorly-produced pre-mill dispensationalist fantasies.

11) At some point in your life, after you are on the public stage, you will sin. We will be there to point it out for you, just in case you don’t see it. After this, we will be sure to label you by your sin for the remainder of your life. If we could (and unfortunately, your lawyers would probably prevent it), we would engrave it on your tombstone. Regardless, we will bring it up at every turn to justify why were were right to hate critize you in the first place. If, by some chance, you don’t have publicly known sin after awhile, we will dig into your past to find it for you.

12) If you attend a church that is not on our short list of “approved” churches (like Grace Community Church in CA), then you don’t really count as “Christian”, as your pedigree is suspect. Should we ever see you in the same photo with Rick Warren, Erwin Mcmanus, Rob Bell or other “Christians” we hate disagree with, you can pretty much expect the ink to flow from our loving pens.

So, please realize that as a Christian artist, you have chosen a profession with more minefields in it than the Kuwaiti border. Your best bet would just be to turn back now. Should you decide to trudge on forward, remember - we will be watching you - like a hawk.

In Christian love,

The watchmen (and women)

38 Responses

  1. pastorboy Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 12:48 pm

    4) If you’re an actor, you’d best marry another actor and ONLY perform with that person. Otherwise, do not take any part which requires you to so much as hold hands with another actor. If you do so, be prepared for an onslaught of criticism for your cavalier attitude toward sexuality.

    Chris, so we should not judge those who call themselves Christians?

    That is why we are accused by the outside world as being filled with hypocrites. Because we are.

    You still have not addressed the example we should set by holy living for those who watch those who are in the public eye.

    Kirk Cameron is an example of an actor who became truly converted and as a result has basicly been blacklisted by hollywood. There are multiple women who have called on Christ and been blacklisted because they wouldn’t do sex or nude scenes anymore.

    Can a Christian really do that (have sex) on camera even if they are married? I don’t think so…

  2. Chris L Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 12:56 pm

    Note:

    I mentioned “holding hands” - noting Amy Grant’s infamous video without her husband, and a notable actress who had both a sex scene and a nude scene in a movie filmed before her conversion, but released after it.

    I’m also hearkening to a post on the old SoL which exoirated an actor for kissing a woman who was not his wife on screen, and a personal example of a Christian actor who kissed an actress on stage each night for the 21-day run of his local show and was criticized from the pulpit for it…

  3. Nathan Rice Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 1:54 pm

    Wow, what a post! These are the kinds of things that make you go, “Why didn’t I think of that!!!???”.

    I really don’t have anything to add. It’s just perfect at explaining the whole situation. Very nice!

    FYI pastorboy, Kirk Cameron wasn’t exactly A-list before he converted. He pretty much had his one role on Growing Pains. He’s not the most gifted actor out there, so it makes pretty good sense that hollywood doesn’t offer him roles very often (if ever). Just to be clear…

  4. Phil Miller Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 1:56 pm

    As I stated in the other thread, I do believe that some of this has to do with the latent Gnosticism that’s still inherent in the church. The only “holy” occupations, if you listen to some, are those of “full-time vocational ministry”. If our time is not spent winning “souls” into heaven, then it’s useless. This world is just going to burn anyway. We’re wasting our time trying to make it better.

    Though some of this isn’t said outright, a lot of it is. I’ve had so many kids come to our campus ministry laden with guilt because they have a passion to be a lawyer, a teacher, etc., but they feel they are wrong because the church they came from tries to pressure them into “the ministry”. I wonder how many people have actually been pushed away from God because of it.

    Also, I would say, people really need to think twice about criticizing someone like Bono or any other person in the public spotlight. Unless you have been in that position, you really have no idea what it’s like. I’m sure Bono deals with a lot of stuff that the vast majority of people never will.

  5. Darren Sapp Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 2:07 pm

    Classical music gets a pass according to Slice Hope.

    (http://ingridschlueter.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/music-to-clean-house-by/) had this quote, “The great violinist Nadja Salerno-Sonnenberg told 60 minutes that she sometimes trembles and weeps when she plays music like the Brahms violin concerto because it is so beautiful. She is a non-believer, and yet she cannot help but show forth God’s glory in her playing. She openly admitted that at her soul’s level, she trembles before the sheer beauty of it all. How sad that she will not acknowledge the source of that beauty.”

    If the wordly music is classical, we can love it and embrace it.

  6. iggy Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 2:19 pm

    Kirk Cameron is an example of an actor who became truly converted and as a result has basicly been blacklisted by hollywood.

    I think we need to understand that some may not see Kirk as an actor…

    (Tongue in cheek here)

    iggy

  7. iggy Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 2:21 pm

    Darren,

    Ingrid shows just how inconsistent and prejudice… let alone how “self” focused these people are!

    A non Christian playing secular classical music… is “godly” while anyone she does not like is not.

    iggy

  8. Chris L Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 2:38 pm

    The only “holy” occupations, if you listen to some, are those of “full-time vocational ministry”.

    This reminds me of a Rich Mullins story - he was going into his Sophomore year at CBS (now CCU, Tim’s Alma Mater), which had a reputation for this type of emphasis. The powers that be asked him to play some of his music for Freshman orientation.

    Two of the self-penned songs he chose were “I Don’t Wanna Be a Preacher” (subject self-explanatory) and “Seminary Girl” (about girls who go to seminary to get their MRS degree as a preacher’s wife).

    Needless to say, he was not asked to do official functions again…

  9. Phil Miller Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 2:50 pm

    Chris,
    I was actually looking for the lyrics of that Rich Mullins song you mentioned, and I found this article complaining about CCM being “anti-fundamentalist”. I think it’s somewhat fitting with your article.

    By the way, do you have the lyrics to those songs? They sound pretty interesting.

  10. jazzact13 Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 2:52 pm

    –He’s (Cameron’s) not the most gifted actor out there,–

    Unlike, say, Will Ferrill, Jean-Claude van Damme (pardon my french), David Spade, Martin Lawrence, Tim Allen, Hulk Hogan, and probably half the other actors out there.

  11. Chris L Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 2:55 pm

    By the way, do you have the lyrics to those songs? They sound pretty interesting.
    I don’t have a copy, no, but I know who I could get them from (though I’m not sure they’d want them published…)

  12. Chris L Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 3:06 pm

    Phil,

    Here’s an excerpt that mentions “Seminary Girl” (the one that seems to echo in legend). The other song (”I Don’t Wanna be a Preacher” might also be called “I Write Songs” - or both):

    While no one ever came out and said it, the faculty’s unofficial stance on Rich was that he was a spiritual anarchist who sometimes had some profound things to say about God but who didn’t think any of the school’s guidelines applied to him. (In his defense, I think that this reputation had more to do with his unwillingness to comply with a “no jeans in class” dress code and the fact that he played the practice pianos harder than the music professors liked to hear them played.) There were mixed feelings about Rich among the students. Everyone thought his music and lyrics were borderline inspiring and it was generally assumed that he lived in the neighborhood of the holy life which most of his songs were about (except for his most popular, “Seminary Girl”.) However, he did not try to hide the fact that he was made of very human raw material and he would let this show on campus from time to time.

  13. Nathan Rice Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 3:09 pm

    “Unlike, say, Will Ferrill, Jean-Claude van Damme (pardon my french), David Spade, Martin Lawrence, Tim Allen, Hulk Hogan, and probably half the other actors out there.”

    Ok, point taken. But all those men (at least the ones who enjoy feature rolls regularly) have entertaining qualities. Comedy actors don’t have to be good actors necessarily. They’re funny, and that makes them valuable to hollywood. Cameron isn’t funny anymore (not that “he” ever was … since he didn’t write his jokes and was a one trick pony when it came to his comedic technique).

    Again, just to be clear :-) FYI, I happen to like Kirk Cameron, although I believe Todd Friel or maybe Ray Comfort seem to have made him a bit more arrogant than he was when he first stared out in the ministry.

  14. Brendt Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 3:28 pm

    9) If you are a singer, every song had best mention “Jesus” (not “God”), or you’re a worldly sell-out.

    Interesting side note. If you listen to Mark Driscoll for more than an hour, you will note that he says “Jesus” a lot. He noted in a message once that he purposefully does so to mark clearly Who/what he is talking about.

    I don’t say that to decry those who don’t, especially for sake of context. Rather, to note that the majority of the “watchmen” are so stinkin’ critical of Driscoll.

  15. Brendt Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 3:33 pm

    Phil: I found this article complaining about CCM being “anti-fundamentalist”

    Here’s another one by the same people. I’m especially proud of that one, because Rich’s quote there comes from an interview that I did with him. It was the first time that I’ve ever hit Google for something that I didn’t write on the ‘net. ;-)

  16. Brendt Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 3:36 pm

    By the way, in case anyone’s interested, here’s the afore-mentioned interview. The Romophobes will probably have a cow.

  17. Chris L Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 3:37 pm

    Oh come on, Brendt, I’ll keep you humble by posting it for you :)

    “Everything is spiritual. Which is another hang-up I have with Protestantism, and even more specifically with Evangelicalism. It’s more like Manicheism than anything else. This dualistic system that says that everything physical is evil, and the only good things are spiritual things. And I go, ‘Wow! John wrote a good bit of what he wrote to counter that kind of thinking.’ And yet, all these Bible-believing, Bible-thumping born-again-ers are going around professing the very thing that John tried to put out” (Brendt Waters, interview with Rich Mullins, conducted in April 1996, fixed link).

    Wow - ‘Everything is Spiritual’… that sounds like a good lecture topic…

  18. Brendt Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 3:49 pm

    Chris, the link you gave (from the driveby, er um, article) is dead now. But the same interview got archived in that link I gave just before yours.

  19. Chris L Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 3:56 pm

    Fixed now :)

  20. Phil Miller Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 4:08 pm

    Brendt,
    Man, that site is a hoot. What in the heck is a worldly rhythm? How does one dicern a wordly rhythm opposed to a non-worldly rhythm?

  21. Chris L Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 4:32 pm

    What in the heck is a worldly rhythm?

    I’m glad you asked! From here:

    First of all, therefore, we are opposed to the use of drums to produce rhythms that are sensual or sexual in nature.

    The Bible says that this world is fallen and under the dominion of sinful men and demons, and God’s people are to separate from the evil things of this world. The Bible makes a sharp distinction between the holy and the profane (Ezek. 22:26), between God and the world (James 4:4; 1 John 2:15-17). John said, “And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness” (1 John 5:19).

    Drums are used in an orchestra and in a military marching band, but they are used differently in this context than in a rock band. In a rock band the drums pound out a steady back beat that dominates the music. In a military marching band the drums are used to mark a straight beat. In an orchestra the drums are used in moderation to support the music rather than to dominate it.

    Rhythm itself is not wrong unless it is misused. Rhythm is a necessary part of music. It keeps the music moving, but it should not dominate. The Bible says it is the melody that should dominate in Christian music. “Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord” (Eph. 5:19).

    Contrast a traditional sacred music song like “Onward Christian Soldiers” with a rock song. Both have rhythm, but the rhythm in most rock songs absolutely dominates and overwhelms the musical piece, whereas the rhythm in “Onward Christian Soldiers” simply complements the lyrical message and moves the song along.

    And

    Not only is the drum an instrument that is as the heart of pounding out a rock & roll back beat in modern society, but it is also intimately associated with the demonic. One of the greatest living experts in drums has testified that they have the power to alter consciousness and to carry people into spirit worlds. Mickey Hart, drummer for the Grateful Dead, has traveled the world researching the power of drums. In his book Drumming at the Edge of Magic he observes: “Everywhere you look on the planet people are USING DRUMS TO ALTER CONSCIOUSNESS. … I’ve discovered, along with many others, the extraordinary power of music, particularly percussion, to influence the human mind and body. . . . There have been many times when I’VE FELT AS IF THE DRUM HAS CARRIED ME TO AN OPEN DOOR INTO ANOTHER WORLD.”

    Mickey Hart is not a professing Christian, but his observation that certain types of rhythm produced by drums can alter consciousness and carry people into other worlds is a loud warning to believers who understand the danger of the demonic. The Bible tells us that there are two spirit worlds, that of God and that of the devil. These worlds are not equal and their power is not equal, but the reality of the demonic world is something that every Christian must learn to deal with. The Bible calls the devil “the prince of the power of the air” and warns that this fallen angel “now worketh in the children of disobedience” (Eph. 2:2). The Bible speaks of “the rulers of the darkness of this world” and “spiritual wickedness in high places” (Eph. 6:12).

    Pearl Primus, an expert on voodoo, says: “THE DRUMMERS KEEP UP A TERRIFIC THROB AND BEAT WHICH VERY EASILY TAKES POSSESSION OF THE SENSIBILITIES OF THE WORSHIPPERS. Observers say that THESE DRUMS THEMSELVES ARE ABLE TO BRING A PERSON TO A PLACE WHERE IT IS EASY FOR THE DEITY (LOA) TO TAKE POSSESSION of their bodies–the defenseless person is buffeted by each stroke as the drummer sets out to ‘beat the loa (god) into his head: The person cringes with each large (accented) beat as if the drum mallet descended upon his very skull; he ricochets about the place, clutching blindly at the arms extended to support him” (Pearl Primus, lecture, Mount Holyoke College, Holyoke, Massachusetts, Mary E. Wooley Hall, 1953; cited from Leonard J. Seidel, Face the Music: Contemporary Church Music on Trial, 1988, pp. 43-42).

  22. iggy Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 4:36 pm

    OK, you think you have made a point… but…

    Let’s see what talents you are missing…

    Will Ferrill ~ He is a writer, producer and an a actor who makes money being bad at acting… yet, he has proven himself to be able to break out of his genre and show he is a bit better actor than some credit him.

    Jean-Claude van Damme ~ Talent is more than acting in action films… can Kirk jump on a counter in the splits while overtaking bag guys doing his own stunts? (As it Time Cop)

    David Spade ~ Spade has sort of lost himself since fellow bad actor Chris Farley died… Yet, he is the classic straight man… at his best. He is talented as he is still doing movies and such.

    Martin Lawrence ~ You must be racist… (Just joking!)

    Tim Allen ~ Tim has come a long way and seems consistent in making family friendly films so not sure why one would knock him… Kirk seems to make Christian films with questionable theology and bad acting and poor effects and even worse video games concepts from a movie ever… (Kill the unbeliever for Jesus!)

    Hulk Hogan ~ You better not let him hear you say he’s a bad actor!

    iggy

  23. Scotty Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 4:39 pm

    I spent 99.5 percent of my music career in the secular end of the business. Maybe half of that time as a studio musician. I’ll admit it, I’ve taken some pretty severe beatings over the years for not doing it within the church walls…

    I’ll be stone cold honest. I’ve always leaned toward r&b, blues and fusion type stuff. I found and still do find most Christian music pretty boring. Not trying to come of as a snob or anything, it just was never my “thing”.

    Played in many different style of bands from the late sixties until about 8 years ago I got weary doing gigs. I was saved in 1976 didn’t a short stint in a church setting and found it all a tough room to work, so to speak….I’m classically trained on keyboards and also in percussion. I’ve even played a pipe organ or two….

  24. Chris L Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 4:42 pm

    Here’s another gem.

    Scotty - I’m a keyboardist. Right now, I play a Roland high-end keyboard (forget the model) and a 1957 Hammond B3 with a Leslie on Sunday mornings…

  25. Phil Miller Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 4:51 pm

    Man, being a fundamentalist in that vein must just be draining. I can’t imagine living life in a state of constant outrage like that. So much for having an easy yoke and a light burden. Being the music-policeman for the church would just have to be draining.

  26. Scotty Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 5:38 pm

    I owned maybe 15 or so version of Hammonds over the years, Chris. Some chopped for portability and some whole…never was famous enough to have a roadies to carry it for me!! Now my B-3 is software driven. Native Instruments makes an EXCELLENT software driven hammond. I have a small studio here in the house and I use it often. AND it’s a heck of a LOT lighter!! lol

    I’ve got a room full of verious racks keyboards and use an old Roland JX-8P as my controller for it all. Using Cakewalk Sonar Producer for my sequencing…..

    I still occaisionally do work for folks via the interent and MIDI. And, I try to keep that to a minimum. I’m retired!! Ain’t interesting in workin’ NO mo! I just play around in the studio to keep up on the new technologies…..it’s the geek in me!

    The best part about doing all my own work in my studio is, the drummer and bass player are ALWAYS sober!

  27. Bruce Gerencser Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 6:16 pm

    MY oldest 3 sons are musicians…….One of them jams with a purely secular bunch of guys. He enjoys it because it is all about the music. No one tries to put the music through a Christian grid.

    I for one steer clear of most things that lead with the word Christian. For every Christian CD I buy I probably buy 10 non Christian Cd’s. I do not own any of the Christian movies. The last Christian movie I saw was “The Burning Hell” Before that? A thief in the Night. (both are horrible movies, poorly done, lame plot) I have not seen the Passion of the Christ (too violent for me)

    Someone mentioned gnosticism and I think they are quite correct.

    Dualism so infects the Evangelical Church it renders us schizophrenic. There is no secular/Christian distinction. We are simply followers of Christ who live in the world.

    Modifying anything with the word Christian does not sanctify it. It is a marketing ploy to extract money from ghetto dwellers.

  28. iggy Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 6:24 pm

    Modifying anything with the word Christian does not sanctify it. It is a marketing ploy to extract money from ghetto dwellers.

    A pastor friend of mine used to laugh at the idea of a “Christian Book Store” as a book cannot accept Christ…

    Budumpt bummm (that was a rim shot)

    iggy

  29. pastorboy Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 7:05 pm

    Sooooooo

    You don’t go to a Christian Church?

  30. Joe C Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 7:27 pm

    Chris L,

    You’re a piano player too? I help lead the worship at my church too on keyboard and sometimes the grand. That’s really cool man. Keep it real on the 88 brother. I’m glad to know that about you!

    Joe

  31. Neil Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 7:53 pm

    “Christian bookstore”

  32. Darren Sapp Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 8:01 pm

    I would like to add a “Hollywood” success story to this topic. Some of you may have seen the movie Friday Night Lights in 2004. One of the characters portrayed was Don Billingsley. He was the party animal and Tim McGraw played his father. Don is a friend of mine and he became a Christian some years after high school.

    He has used that movie to share the story if his conversion to thousands of students. He has been to my church twice and is coming in April to speak to the middle schoolers I teach in AWANA. He does an excellent job of using a few discreet clips from the movie and presents a full Gospel message, particularly to define spiritual lostness and how Jesus saved him from the pit he was in.

    By the way, he says the movie is very accurate regarding football, but his Dad was not like that at all.

  33. Bruce Gerencser Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 8:03 pm

    Pastorboy,

    How can I go to what I am?

  34. iggy Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 8:51 pm

    You don’t go to a Christian Church?

    i am beginning to wonder myself about you… LOL!

    You are preaching the American gospel there… as the church is not a building… it is a living organism that has an institution that helps run it that may meet in a building…. but it is not a building… so, no that is a bad name for a… Now, in the world’s understanding making Christianity one of the worlds religions… then yes you might go to a “Christian” church… but then you will have to accept that it is equal to all other religions… is that what you believe? LOL!

    You see this is an example of Gnostic dualism as it has influenced the Church… we make a Noun… a person in to an adjective… we make Truth a Person, into an abstract concept apart from the Person of Jesus.

    iggy

  35. pastorboy Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 11:07 pm

    How did I say the church is a building?

    We do meet in a building, but we are not a building

    Though we are the temple of God, and at the same time living stones….

  36. Bruce Gerencser Says:
    January 21st, 2008 at 11:24 pm

    Pastorboy

    You said “Christian church” How were we to take that phrase?

    you also said “GO TO A Christian Church and last I knew that meant going to a building. Thus my comment, How can I go to what I am?

    I go to buildings where Christ followers congregate.(I feel the old Tim and the Rock concert thread cycling back around)

    Inanimate objects can not be Christian anything. They are buildings, radio stations, bookstores, tv stations, concert venues, etc. They have no spiritual ability. It is what PEOPLE do with those things that matter.

    In the new covenant we have no tabernacle, no sacred space. no holy of holies.

    Why is this important. Well……….30 years of ministry has allowed me to see a lot of fussing over the “building” How dare we EAT in the sanctuary., etc, etc, etc, God does not dwell in building made with hands.

    The Church is a living breathing people. That’s why it is a big deal when you ODM’s keep lopping off parts of the body. You cripple all of us.

    Bruce, the posterior part of the Church

  37. iggy Says:
    January 22nd, 2008 at 1:05 am

    PB,

    How did I say the church is a building?

    We do meet in a building, but we are not a building

    Though we are the temple of God, and at the same time living stones….

    You stated:

    Sooooooo

    You don’t go to a Christian Church?

    It seems that you think “Christian” and “Church” are something you go to… and in a way we do in the smaller gatherings translated as “church”….

    But it was always in reference to “those who gather” yet we translate it as a place to go…

    So, then you are saying you do not go to a “Christian” Church?

    LOL!
    iggy

  38. Chris Says:
    January 22nd, 2008 at 5:07 am

    We actually have the “Ark of the Covenant” at my church. Shhhhhhhh! Don’t tell anyone.

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