Irony, Thy Name is Ingrid
Apparently, Ingrid views herself as God’s chosen instrument to criticize the Church, but when someone does it in a way she doesn’t approve of - watch out. In this article, Ingrid attacks Frank Schaeffer, the son of renowned author and thinker, Francis Schaeffer for writing an autobiography about growing up in the Evangelical fishbowl.
Now I have to admit that I haven’t read this book yet, so I can’t offer commentary on the actual content yet. After reading Ingrid’s scathing review, though, I went and looked it up on Amazon, and the vast majority of reviews there (a lot of them are from Christians) are positive. Most applaud Schaeffer for writing an honest book about himself and his parents. I guess Ingrid would rather gloss over the messy parts of life though.
I get the feeling that Ingrid genuinely thinks that the 50s and 60s were the golden years for the church and bad things never happened. If someone come out says that they weren’t all good, then we attack that person. The Church has and always we be imperfect until Jesus returns, and in the meantime, I don’t see a little healthy introspection as a bad thing.
December 3rd, 2007 at 2:24 pm
Yes, but at least she thinks we should pray for him. It’s an improvement.
December 3rd, 2007 at 2:42 pm
Good for her!
What a big girl!
This is about having an allergy to honesty…unless it’s Ingrid being honest about someone else.
December 3rd, 2007 at 2:44 pm
but… but… he said bad words. he must be bad!!!
December 3rd, 2007 at 2:49 pm
I do have reservations about the book. Writing so critically after the subjects are dead and there’s no one else around that has the authority to speak to what happens triggers some alarms for me.
That being said, if Ingrid had expressed those sentiments reasonably rather than mounting a screeching defense based on ad hominem attacks on Frankie, it’d be a much more credible article.
December 3rd, 2007 at 2:58 pm
Tim,
That was my reaction, too, until I went and read some of the reviews. Actually, I think Mrs. Schaeffer is still alive and still has a somewhat good relationship with her son. I guess he has taught her how to dance recently, and it seems some reconciliation has happened. My general sense from reading the reviews was that the book was a lot less salacious and mean-spirited than Ingrid makes it out to be.
This is another instance where I will probably buy a book based on Ingrid’s trashing of it.
December 3rd, 2007 at 3:40 pm
I just wrote a rough draft about this yesterday. What Ingrid seems to miss here is the fruit. I wonder if this were Erwin McManus’s boy or McLaren’s would she be as gracious to the parent? I bet we’d see shriek pieces about the corruption of their fruit. I read Frank’s stuff and I wonder what kind of life that kid grew up in to foster that kind of hate. While his mother and he have reconciled (so I understand) he makes no bones about not being able to stand his father. How much of this is the fruit of the father? Why doesn’t Ingrid ask that?
December 3rd, 2007 at 3:52 pm
Great point from Joe Martino…
And they bash people for “celebrity worship”, but she couldn’t resist saying she was in Edith’s living room…intimating a kind of relational knowledge…
whatever.
December 3rd, 2007 at 4:14 pm
Joe does make an excellent point. If it was Bell’s son she would castigate him for being a poor parent. Shaeffer was good but a little too intellectaul for my taste but let’s all be honest, if it wasn’t for God’s grace being sufficient enough to overcome our many parental shortcomings none of our kids would turn out right.
The only reason people get to rub shoulders with famous Christians is that their father built a radio station. I saw Billy Graham once!
December 3rd, 2007 at 4:55 pm
Here is a recent gem from the prophetess Ingrid called to publicly rebuke pastors:
“I challenge Bill Hybels to come out from behind the pancake make-up for television, out from behind his scores of media and public relations specialists, away from his handlers and hair-dressers and circus acrobats and answer this like a man. There is no biblical justification for what you are doing, Mr. Hybels. None. By bringing someone like Brian McLaren to your church who denies the basic doctrines of God’s Word, including the atoning work of Jesus Christ on the cross, you are spitting in the face of Christ and making mockery of the deaths of the martyrs throughout history who died for those precious truths.”
OK, I agree with not having MacLaren speak, but notice the hyperbole and and sarcasm. Cann’t anyone present a cojent and humble observation. I love the “I challenge Bill Hybels”. Wow, now we have people’s wives going around challenging pastors to do what? Come out from the pancake make-up and answer like a man.
Man, it beggers description. Hybels is shaking in his boots.
December 3rd, 2007 at 5:45 pm
It sounds like Ingrid knows Frank and his mother personally! It sounds Frank’s mother has been hurt by him in the past and Ingrid also felt some of her pain. Honestly, I have to agree some of the points she makes. Frank’s book doesn’t sound very honoring toward his parents. Some things are better left unsaid, especially in a book for sale to the general public. I’m not a big fan of “tell-all” biographies; I can’t help but think about the embarassment it may have caused others. It sounds like Frank and his mother have reconciled, and I pray that Ingrid will have a forgiving heart as well.
December 3rd, 2007 at 5:49 pm
Merry,
If Rick Warren’s son (does he even have one?) came out with a “tell-all” book would Ingrid talk about “uncovering your parents nakedness” or would she rub her hand in glee at the new dirt her “news” outlet was about to share with the world? I struggle to believe she would do the former.
December 3rd, 2007 at 5:56 pm
I must agree with Joe periodically, it cleanses he toxins!
December 3rd, 2007 at 6:24 pm
Ingrid… oh workmanapproved* she is…
In all my dealings with her she mixes Law and grace and cannot see that she does.
iggy
*This is one of her user names she uses on DT’s site and on mine when she came to defend doing that hit piece on Dan Kimball the day his dad died… just outing her here so all will know. = )
December 3rd, 2007 at 7:21 pm
Regarding the book…World Magazine did an interview with Schaeffer. I think it’s from the Nov. 3 issue?
December 3rd, 2007 at 8:12 pm
Rev. Joe, FYI Rick Warren has 2 sons and a daughter.
I sincerely hope they are Christians themselves and having a good relationship with their parents. I cannot guess what Ingrid would do. I just hope Ingrid and everyone else understands that a) no Christian or Christian leader or their families is ever perfect, b) one should never put a particular Christian leader on a pedistal and expect them to be perfect, and c) God’s grace is sufficient for all of us no matter what we’ve done.
December 3rd, 2007 at 8:15 pm
No child should publicly expose their parent’s sins. Love covers a multitude of sins. But would Ingrid take such a defense of Rob Bell if his son wrote an unflattering book about his father, or would she pile on?
December 3rd, 2007 at 8:27 pm
I don’t personally think we need to speculate about what Ingrid would do in certain situations. What I would suggest is that we pray for both Frank and Ingrid. Everyone needs prayer for God’s wisdom in their lives, even the people we don’t agree with.
December 3rd, 2007 at 8:29 pm
For those interested in learning more in-depth my thoughts about this matter I refer you to here. (See Tim, I can link whore too!!!)
December 3rd, 2007 at 9:30 pm
Now Ken’s shown up and called me mean names. That hurt. It really does.
December 4th, 2007 at 12:00 am
FYI for iggy. I am the “approved workman”
You should remember that as you have commented on my blogsite where that name is used.
December 4th, 2007 at 12:19 am
I wonder what kind of a tantrum would erupt if iggy decided to refer to himself as an “approved workman”…?
December 4th, 2007 at 12:20 am
I dunno but I’ve decided to refer to myself as Team Awesome! And that exclamation point is part of the title.
December 4th, 2007 at 12:22 am
My moniker will be:
The Commenter that Jesus Loves
December 4th, 2007 at 12:47 am
Can I be “Optimus Prime Tom Brady Patriots Rule Megatron He-Man”?
Sweet…
December 4th, 2007 at 1:59 am
Chris P…
It seems you are right… LOL! feel better? As I went back to check it seems you posted in defense of Ingrid’s attack piece and when you stated “I did not attack Dan Kimball…” it sounded like you were stating that you wrote the hit piece… so I publicly apologize to Ingrid in that she is not you. Much of this confusion would not happen if you would let your profile be seen on Blogger so that one could see that it was you… and you still mix grace with law and seem to be in bondage to legalism.
Thanks for setting me straight.
iggy
December 4th, 2007 at 8:49 am
You can call me “Patriot-Man was almost defeated if not for his evil side-kick BLIND OFFICIAL”
Actually I was rooting for the Pats but come-on 13 penalties for the Ravens and 2 for the Pats.
Sorry Julie! Sports hi-jack.
December 4th, 2007 at 9:00 am
Wait a minute….I agree with Dog the Bounty Hunters son for exposing him! LOL
Hey everyone, I will be posting a tell all about my Father and it will only cost 20$ a month to subscribe. I will post my fathers short comings on a weekly basis and they are promised to be juicy! The first entry-” Rick Frueh beat me up!” A blow by blow description of my childhood spankings. LOL
December 4th, 2007 at 9:37 am
I enjoy surfing around here from time to time, but i’m not much for commenting and jumping in…
However, having just finished the book in question (and being tremendously influenced by both Schaeffers over the years), I thought I’d offer a thought or two…
Maybe my perspective is different - I’m a third generation pastor, and have been doing this for over 20 years - and I found myself resonating with much of what Schaeffer wrote, both in terms of the evangelical sub-culture and his upbringing in that world…
I saw this less as a tell-all about his family and more about an indictment on a movement that in many ways still causes division and confusion (the religious right, fundamentalist Christianity, et al)…
Whether or not tell-all memoirs are everyone’s cup of tea, I think is besides the overarching point - Schaeffer and his family were huge components and shapers to the way many evangelicals operate and think to this day, and the book simply presents the people behind it all as very human and fallible…
If Frank isn’t kind to his parents (which I don’t think is an accurate reading of the book), he is equally as unkind to himself…
I didn’t pick up on any “hatred” at all - unless honesty is now considered hatred…
This was Frank’s life, warts and all, and is a very sobering account of what celebrity Christianity is capable of doing to the frailty of a family…
I highly recommend the book…
Just a few thoughts from the sidelines…
Thanks for listening…keep up all of your good posts…
December 4th, 2007 at 9:48 am
Thanks Chuck.
December 4th, 2007 at 9:52 am
Thanks Chuck, I just quoted you on my own piece about this affair.
December 4th, 2007 at 10:02 am
Sorry Jon, Rick has been far too transparent for that to sell all that well. You should have been related to someone who is more afraid of revealing their shortcomings.
December 4th, 2007 at 10:04 am
I would be afraid of Jon’s book if I had any shortcomings.
December 4th, 2007 at 10:05 am
Chuck,
Your review confirms my suspicions. I too am a third generation pastor, and I guess being an “insider” to the Evangelical world has shown that things are rarely what they appear on the outside, especially with the more famous and powerful someone becomes. I really don’t know why this seems to bother people so much, other than I guess there are a lot of people who have something to hide.
If Christian can’t talk openly and honestly, what hope is there for us to reach others?
December 4th, 2007 at 11:07 am
The funny thing is this book wasn’t on my radar at all, but now that I see Ingrid hates it, it get’s added to the list. I’ve found more books, music and artists that make it into my regular rotation just by reading who Ingrid, Ken, Pyros and co. all hate. It’s like having a sign at a bookstore saying “The Staff DOES NOT Pick” it still highlights just the same
That being said, tell-alls aren’t really my genre, but I do always appreciate when writings come out reminding us that all are fallen, even the best of Christians have their blindspots and struggles.
I think often we put authors, pastors etc. on a pedestal that is unhelpful to us, and I this book may help people for whom Francis Shaffer was the one they frustraitingly compared their life and walk to. For that it may serve a pretty good purpose.
Also as someone who is first-genreration in ministry, I try to read as many books by pastors kids as I can so I know how to best live when I become a parent (although the consensus seems to be that when I have kids, I should probably quit and work at the comic book store!)
December 4th, 2007 at 11:54 am
Wow…
any resistance to honesty is amazing to me…
especially when the sub-cultural ghetto that is evangelicalism/fundamentalism is so obsessed with “truth”.
December 4th, 2007 at 12:56 pm
Just ordered a copy.
Thank you, Ingrid. Love ya. Lots
You too, Ken.
December 4th, 2007 at 1:54 pm
Chris,
Brady is clutch. You had to see it coming. Ravens imploded, and are a messy team, and the calls were good. Go watch ESPN, the replays tell all.
I’m sticking with my name, but adding…
“Optimus Prime Tom Brady Patriots Rule [16-0] Megatron He-Man”
Sorry for the Hijack. Ingrid hates everything, that’s my position on this subject.
Joe
December 4th, 2007 at 2:04 pm
The last line really got to me.
But only after we sincerely trash him.
December 4th, 2007 at 4:53 pm
I appreciate your input, Chuck. I am highly suspicious about people judging a book and telling others to read or not read it, when they’ve not read it themselves.
Has Ingrid really read the full book? Or someone else’s rehash of it?
Here’s that World Magazine interview/article on the book…though you might not get to it if you don’t have a password…not sure.