Driscoll’s confession, Watchdoggie contempt
Here is a bit of a transcript of one of Mark Driscoll’s sermons (either recently passed or about to be preached).
I believe that humility is the great omission and failure in my eleven years of preaching. I believe that this is my greatest oversight both in my example and in my instruction.
I therefore do not claim to be humble. I do not claim to have been humble. I am convicted of my pride, and I am a man who is by God’s grace pursuing humility.
So in many ways this is a sermon that I’m preaching at myself, this is a sermon you are welcomed to listen in on as I preach to myself.
But I truly believe that were there one thing I could do over in the history of Mars Hill it would be in my attitude and in my actions and in my words to not only emphasize sound doctrine, encourage in strength and commitment and conviction but, to add in addition to that, humility as a virtue.
And so I’ll start by asking your forgiveness and sincerely acknowledging that this has been a great failure.
Now go and read some of the comments to this. Its really amazing that a public confession could be picked apart like that.
November 9th, 2007 at 6:32 pm
nc is no fan of Marky Mark D.
But I am thankful he admitted that his pride impacts and forms his community.
I can think of some other well known types whose church membership is seen as sharing in their demeanor, etc.
It doesn’t help a church’s reputation.
November 9th, 2007 at 7:14 pm
I say this with the most pathetic humility I can muster, that I don’t have…
But I’d like to see Ken Silva be as humble and contrite in spirit as that man was in that confession. But instead, he attacked him.
Right, that’s how we’re supposed to handle brothers who have repented of sin. Yup, exactly like that.
=( Not.
Joe
November 9th, 2007 at 7:29 pm
Why is it that I cannot recall a pastor admitting publicly he is lacking humility. And although there may be other issues some can disagree with about Driscoll’s views, how can we take issue with those wonderful words? And then to see that Steve Camp attacks him because of a secondary offense and Steve’s logic is that because Driscoll made some remark about one of his friends proves that Driscoll isn’t serious about humility. What? I think Driscoll admitted the very same.
Maybe Driscoll could cut off his ear.
November 9th, 2007 at 7:32 pm
Jesus would heal him, so what would that accomplish?
November 9th, 2007 at 7:38 pm
Perhaps what we should do then is pray for Ken and Steve?
Father, thankyou that Mark had the courage to admit in public he is lacking humility. Use this to humble my heart also, and bless Ken and Steve in their work using this to humble them also.
November 9th, 2007 at 7:49 pm
The LORD knows I’m no Silva fan, but I didn’t see his name on the comment thread at all.
November 9th, 2007 at 9:55 pm
And to think I was a big fan of Steve Camp music.
November 10th, 2007 at 12:00 am
Joe,
It was Ken who criticized and attacked Mark even when he had made a confession of lack of humility. That’s how he was connected to this. I’d just very much like to see Ken repent in the same way. We would do well to admit our own lack of humility and come to God broken over the sin in our own lives too. We all have problems
Joe C
November 10th, 2007 at 12:10 am
Joe C,
Would you mind showing me the reference? Again, I’m not trying to defend Silva here, but I read the comment thread three times, I’ve checked C?N a few times and I haven’t seen anything. Since Driscoll’s
throwing of his friends under the bus for his own personal gainpreaching on his “concerns” about McLaren, Pagitt and the slandering of Rob Bell he seems to be on the ODM’s good side.November 10th, 2007 at 12:32 am
Hey Joe, yeah no problem.
http://christianresearchnetwork.com/?p=3637
And hey, if Mark feels convicted that he was wrong, and that his friends are wrong too, then it’s not ‘throwing them under the bus’, it’s called following your convictions, hopefully grounded in Scripture. Who are you to judge your brother like that, Joe? Each one will stand before God for Judgment, and before their own Maker they will stand or fall. It seems contradictory to what everyone on this site is trying to accomplish; to do line-throughs and make snide comments just like the ODMS do to attack others. Be graceful, ok?
The ODMs bring up great points sometimes, and fall so short other times. And this site is exactly the same with getting much right and messing up elsewhere. Exactly what I would expect from redeemed sinners. Exactly what I see in myself, by God’s Grace. And exactly why we need Jesus’ righteousness and not our own. Thanks much brother.
In Love,
Joe
According to Silva, Mark isn’t on their ‘good side’.
November 10th, 2007 at 8:34 am
That article was posted by Dwayna, not Ken Silva
November 10th, 2007 at 10:28 am
Ahh, Dwayna–she of the 700 categories.
November 10th, 2007 at 10:52 am
Ken, Dwayna, editor, general editor… who cares. it is all rubbish anyway.
It seems she misses that Steve Camp is more offended than the guy that supposedly was offended and then demanded that Mark apologize… what arrogance on Steve and Dwayna’s part. They truly fail to acknowledge God working in Driscoll’s life and still must take their swipes at him. I see these as on the level as sociopaths or psychopaths… they only get pleasure in their critiquing of others… that is so sick.
I was truly blessed to read Marks confession and truly angered to read those who insisted on attacking him.
Be blessed,
iggy
November 10th, 2007 at 11:19 am
Just got over to C?N to read Dwayna’s post.
Her post is so littered with wrong information, disengenous research, innuendo, and guilt by association assumptions it is really difficult (read impossible) to give her any credibility for anything she reports.
November 10th, 2007 at 11:31 am
It was really hard to read… I had to re-read it twice before i realized she was slamming Crossway publishers! LOL!
Yep, even they have gone to the dark side…
Amazing who we can go from a sincere heartfelt confession to how some publisher is going emergent… how these guys connect things is like listening to David Icke and how the reptilian race is the fault of all things evil… I mean those poor reptilians… all they did was get born with scales and humanoid features…
Be blessed,
iggy
November 10th, 2007 at 11:53 am
This is about the same level I read Ms Litz…
http://www.whale.to/b/gardner.html
The funny thing is I think David Icke is better at research… he just comes to weird conclusions…
It is a fun read in and of itself… but replace Sir Laurence Gardner with any emergent leader, and then replace the word reptilian and alien with emergent and shape shifting with theology… and viola! you have a great CRN or Slice post!
LOL!
be blessed,
iggy
November 10th, 2007 at 1:06 pm
Dude…what did I just read…?
Dragon bloodline? Okay, so the Emergents AREN’T the craziest group out there afterall.
Merovingian….lol…all I could think of was the second Matrix movie.
Har har har. Bottom line about the link I provided from CRN, if it’s on there, then it’s approved by the ‘general editor’, and would have their seal of approval. And we all know who that is.
Overall, I’m just glad Pastor Driscoll has been led to repentance over his lack of humility and not training his congregation quite right. I pray all of us have the same experience with the Lord leading us to repent of our long held sins.
Joe
Joe
November 10th, 2007 at 1:09 pm
uh-oh. Be careful.
Criticizing ODM’s, The KenIngrid and Ms. Litz is, in itself, mean and vicious.
You evil emergents.
Joe C,
I love your tone and approach in how you write here. Question:
Even if the ODM’s are right about some things. (To which I would concede very little, but that’s another issue). Do you think their general approach is really helpful…even if the substance is “correct”? I mean, having to wade through all their inflammatory garbage seems to inspire a corollary attitudinal sinfulness in their followers/readers. To me that disqualifies them from speaking–it reveals a deep attitudinal sinfulness entrenched in their thinking and hearts (despite their attestations to being a “sinner no better” and their “love for the gospel”.) What’s the point of defending the Gospel if they betray it by their means and comportment?
November 10th, 2007 at 1:26 pm
Joe,
I too appreciate you here… stay around a bit… you might get me to stop being so mean! LOL!
be blessed,
iggy
November 10th, 2007 at 1:26 pm
“What’s the point of defending the Gospel if they betray it by their means and comportment? ”
It is like spreading Islam through violence. Like handing nutritional food wrapped in poison. Like playing the stereo so loud it distorts the words. Like the homeless speaking on financial investments.
Love and humility bring the power requisite for substantive communication, otherwise, sounding brass and tinkling cymbal.
November 10th, 2007 at 1:46 pm
nc,
I humbly agree with you about the methods of the ODMs. I think it’s distracting, hurtful, and un Christ-like. And the good gets lost in the cacophomy of vitrol.
Rick, I’m with you on your comparisons. Right with you. Except the part about Islam. Knowing much of Islam, the Qu’ran and Hadiths, I have to admit, spreading Islam through violence is the way it is commanded to be spread. So they’re doing the ‘right thing’. But you’re right, any redeemable qualities are lost in the message of violence and destruction that comes with it.
I am in the US military, and by trade I know what Islam is, and it’s nothing like most of the Americans in this country think it is, nor what the ‘muslims’ in this country practice. You’ll have to take me at my word, unless you also know, but hey, this post isn’t about islam anyways, don’t know how it turned in to that haha.
Good points though nc and Rick. And thanks Iggy, I’m glad you find me easy to converse with, I’ve very happy about this. You guys are very easy to talk with also.
Joe
November 10th, 2007 at 1:49 pm
Oh oH, I know I know, calling American and ‘moderate’ islam, the actual religion of “Islam”, is like calling the crusades a “Christian” endevour. Wow, thats kinda confusing, oh well!
November 10th, 2007 at 4:41 pm
Joe,
How postmodern of you! LOL!
Just kidding!
November 10th, 2007 at 5:09 pm
Well…now I must be officially postmodern, since I seemed confused about one thing. According to the standard ‘guilt by no matter what’ of the ODMs, I must be in cahoots with Oprah!!! Can it be?
http://christianresearchnetwork.com/?p=3685
LOL
Joe
November 10th, 2007 at 6:34 pm
I can’t believe David Icke got into this conversation.
(Now, does using the word “conversation” make me emergent? Do I need to find another word?)
November 10th, 2007 at 7:09 pm
Nope, too late, you’re emergent now.
Yeah…that word is copywrited, by emergent, under penalty of becoming emergent by unauthorized usage. Welcome to the club….-sigh-
LOL
Joe (if using the word conversation makes one emergent, I’ve been emergent forever!!!)
November 10th, 2007 at 7:51 pm
Joe and Julie,
The irony that using the word “conversation” making one emergent was copyrighted by Ken Silva… this made it easier for him to hit a bigger target.
Thank you, thank you very much… (in my best Velvet Elvis voice)
iggy
(the only emergent who has yet to read and Rob Bell’s books)
November 10th, 2007 at 9:14 pm
LOL w/e, I don’t believe you. You’re not the ONLY one, why else are all you guys exactly alike? [sarcasm]
Hahaha
Joe
November 11th, 2007 at 1:40 pm
Ig,
True emergent confessions…
I’ve only read Generous Orthodoxy and The Church on the Other Side by McLaren.
I’ve skimmed Velvet Elvis and wasn’t blown away. I like the Nooma vids better.
I’ve read A Heretics Guide to Eternity (but that’s not an “emergent” guy, no matter how much people want to make Spencer Burke emergent).
I think these guys have interesting things to say for their audiences, I support their right to speak their mind, but a lot of what they are writing about is stuff I’ve already thought about, been concerned with, etc. from back in my church planting days. I don’t need their opinions about…anything really. They aren’t my gurus (or anyone else’s for that matter as far as I can see…just cuz they sell books doesn’t mean they are. sorry.)
anyway.