Today, we have another blazingly idiotic (to be kind) post from “Pastor Paul”, the kind of advice that devastates and ruins families who eschew seeking professional assistance (oft-times with temporary need for pharmaceutical assistance) because they’ve received bad counsel.  This is really not any different that JW’s who refuse blood transfusions and parents, like those of Amanda Bates, who listened to church leaders explain why they shouldn’t receive medical care.

“Pastor Paul” gives awful advice.  As the parent of a child with ADHD, with friends or relatives with each of the conditions mentionged, I cannot stress what a disservice you do to yourself, your children and your family when you consistently prolong avoidance of treatment – even visiting a Christian counsellor – with persistent psychological, medical conditions.  Certainly, prayer heals.  Certainly, there are often behavioral issues related to sin with many psychological disorders.  Certainly, there are those who abuse this and excuse bad behavior, but Tautges’ advice is pure, unadulterated quackery. 

I’m not sure I would write much new that I didn’t already say a few months back, so I think I will just start with a repost of the previous article (rather than pretend to write something new, when it would really be a rehash – not that I know anybody who does anything like that.)

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WatchdawggieIssue: The role of counseling, psychotherapy (including psychiatric drugs), and addiction recovery programs in the Christian church

CRN/Slice Take: I have to say that I am not completely sure where they stand today, but there was more evidence of where they stood before Slice came down.

This article by Paul Tautges of CRN gives some indication of the disdain for psychological drugs and Christian counselors who use more resources than just the Bible in their counseling.

This was the conviction of the early Christians. They had the godly audacity to believe that man can become complete in Christ without the help of psychologists, psychiatrists, or mood-altering drugs.

He goes on to lay out three precepts from which counseling should come:

  • God’s Word is sufficient to deal with every problem man faces.

In our day, pastors are intimidated by the mental health “professionals,” but the early Christians believed that there is nothing man experiences that God does not directly or indirectly address in His Word. They believed the Scriptures are sufficient to teach us doctrine—truth with a capital T. They believed the Word confronts us when we get off the right path and shows us how to get back on. And they believed the Scriptures train us to live godly lives so that we can mature and become equipped to serve God.
All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work (2 Tim. 3:16-17).

  • Man is responsible for his own actions.

In our day, blame shifting has almost become a virtue, but the early Christians had the courage to lay fault at the right doorstep. We read of people like the 56-year old man who is presently suing four major fast food chains because of health problems caused by his obesity. Of course, he is not responsible for putting his hand to his mouth. It is the restaurants’ fault! In our world this man is consoled. In biblical times he would have received a sermon on gluttony. How refreshing it is when the light of Truth pierces so sharply through the thick cloud of man’s deception.

Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am being tempted by God”; for God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone. But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death. Do not be deceived, my beloved brethren.

  • The Holy Spirit is the “Agent of Change.”

In our day, men pay good money to be told they are hopelessly victimized by their past or their DNA, but the early Christians freely dispensed the hope found in the Gospel and were confident of the life-changing power of the Holy Spirit. As we take our eyes off ourselves and put them on Christ we are changed into His image by the Spirit of God.

But we all, with unveiled face beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as from the Lord, the Spirit (2 Cor. 3:18).

These core beliefs naturally led the early Christians to practice what is referred to as nouthetic counseling. The nouthetic approach to counseling grows out of two NT words: noutheses and noutheteo. The words mean to warn, to admonish, or to exhort. They always imply an aspect of confrontation so as to effect change. Jay Adams says this approach to helping people contains three basic elements. [iv] First, it presupposes a need for change; that there is something in the life that God wants changed. Second, problems are solved by verbal means; that is, the stress is placed on ‘What’—what is wrong? And what needs to be done about it? The Word spoken in encouragement, admonishment, or rebuke renews the mind, which leads to transformation of life. Third, the purpose for counseling is always that the counselee benefit by seeking to change that in his life which hurts him.

When this kind of ministry is examined in the New Testament, three principles become obvious.

  • Pastors are required to counsel and equip others to be counselors.

[...]

  • Every believer is expected to be a counselor.

[...]

  • The local church is the intended and ideal place for counseling.

From the old Slice, there were several articles (for which I don’t have all the links since Ingrid threw her tizzy, took her ball and went home) which denigrated both public 12-Step programs and the scripture-based Celebrate Recovery program developed by Pastor John Baker at Saddleback. There were also links to sites which had articles on the evils of Myers-Briggs personality tests, Ritalin and anti-depressant drugs. Since Slice 2.0 came back, I’ve not seen anything on these subjects.

My Take: [I do need to insert some information about potential conflict of interest for myself in writing this response. I work for a pharmaceutical company that has a Neuroscience division, though my work is in leadership development and project management for the Human Resources function.]

There are a number of inherent dangers of seeking counseling from a professional who is not an active practicing Christian. I wholeheartedly agree. There are also a number of family/personal problems than can be and should be dealt with by the church – with pastors and small group leaders as obvious ‘first steps’. I would even say that this is the first – and often only – place one would need to go.

However.

Psychiatric Drugs:

There are a number of serious psychological illnesses which cannot be simply counseled away. Yes, I believe in the power of the Holy Spirit and the power of prayer in healing anything and everything. I also believe that we have been given scientific and medical “discoveries” (which I enclose in quotes, since God knew they were there thousands of years before we “discovered” them) with which to give immediate treatment for acute conditions and chronic ailments whose need may – with healing – go away.

I would guess that Pastor Tautges, were he having a heart attack, would appreciate both prayer and CPR be applied. Or, if he were diagnosed with diabetes, he would trust the Holy Spirit to work through prayer, but he wouldn’t neglect his insulin dosages.

In the same way, there are serious chemically-caused illnesses which can be treated and/or cured with psychiatric drugs in combination with counseling from a Christian professional. Without pharmaceutical treatment, these people would be a danger to both themselves and others. Schizophrenia, dimentia, bipolar disorder, certain addictions and clinical depression (as opposed to situational depression) all would fall into this category. These are not things to mess around with sans Christian professional assistance – which brings us to:

Christian Psychiatry

Cries of “oxymoron” (which are just moronic) aside, Christian psychiatry/psychotherapy can be helpful, beneficial AND godly. The Bible carries a wealth of information on dealing with personal and interpersonal problems, and it is not sinful to use sources which pull these together, written by Christian psychologists/psychiatrists (like, for instance, The Search for Significance by Robert McGee).

I agree that it is also important to ONLY use Christian counselors, recommended by your pastor, who can separate un-Biblical psychological techniques from scriptural or neutral ones. For instance, Myers-Briggs personality types can be useful in helping a person learn to interact with other people – based on their personalities. This is not un-Biblical, because it is simply recognition of natural phenomena that have always existed – in the same way that Newton’s recognition of the Law of Gravity was not Biblical or un-Biblical; he just recognized a natural pattern and labeled it!

With that said, parts of Pastor Tautges ‘three precepts’ are simplistic, at best.

Yes, the God’s Word is sufficient for our daily problems. It tells us how to deal with them from a spiritual standpoint. However, in terms of specifics, it is not what it does not claim to be. In the same way that you will not find instructions on how to perform open-heart surgery in the Bible, it will not tell you how to tell the difference between a disobedient child who just won’t sit still and a child with ADHD who may need non-intuitive and/or medicinal assistance.

Yes, man is responsible for his own actions. However, there are some genetic pre-conditions (such as those proven for alcoholism), which make dealing with specific types of sins much more difficult than for the average Joe (not you, though, Joe M. – you’re above average! -C ). The fault, guilt and consequences all belong to that individual – BY ALL MEANS – but to only say to them “go and sin no more…” is the equivalent of saying “peace be filled” to the starving man (more on this below).

Yes, the Holy Spirit is the agent of change. Once again, like with other CRN writers, the implication seems to be that the Holy Spirit must only act by fiat (from nothing) and not with the aid of something outside of direct application of scripture. There are a number of issues one may have had in growing up, in relationships and such, which professional Christian counselors may be able – with the aid of the Holy Spirit – to root out and help the person deal with in a scriptural manner – whether it be forgiveness for past wrongs, patterns of behavior which lead to temptation and sin, etc.

12-Step Programs

I have known a fairly large number of folks in the recovery community, and I have actually found that people who have been through this type of recovery are often the ones most receptive to the message of the gospel. They already have had to admit that they are the cause of their problems and that they, by themselves, cannot overcome them. The language of that community – the “higher power” – can be VERY dangerous, because it opens up anyone/anything to be that “higher power”. I try to use that for good by engaging them on a discussion on who/what their “higher power” is, and lead that into a discussion of Christ as the perfect “higher power” who does far more than free us from addiction and its consequences.

But that is for people who are in or have been through 12-Step Programs.

For people with addictive behaviors (alcohol, drugs, sexual addiction, overeating, relationship addiction, co-dependency, etc.) who need this type of healing – I recommend the Celebrate Recovery program developed at Saddleback, which is available at churches nation (and world) wide (there are 10 chapters in and around Indianapolis, including one at my church). This program is Biblically-based and helps people living in addictive cycles to find God-honoring ways to break these cycles. It does not mess around with “higher powers” or have to tap-dance around issues of faith like some 12-Step chapters do.

In summary, I may not be that far off from where Slice 2.0 sits on this issue, though I am sure that the old “amen chorus” of Slice 1.0 would have my head on a platter…

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16 Comments(+Add)

1   Rick Frueh    http://judahslion.blogspot.com/
September 6th, 2007 at 4:26 pm

From your post and your words, Chris, you seem to have about 9 steps yet to wholeness. I would recommend drugs, but I don’t believe in them until I need them.

2   Chris L    http://www.fishingtheabyss.com/
September 6th, 2007 at 4:28 pm

They say that, apart from Step 1, Step 4 is the hardest…

3   Tim Reed    http://theotstrikesback.com
September 6th, 2007 at 4:31 pm

Thank God people are writing things like this. Just a couple of points.

1. Medication instead of counseling (or medication without counseling) can be just as bad as nothing. Especially for anxiety type disorders drugs alone are rarely enough.

2. By the time people come to their pastors/leaders with sin issues things have progressed to the point where professional counseling is required. This is especially true with marital problems.

4   M.G.    
September 6th, 2007 at 4:37 pm

Wow. So irresponsible. They actually have bipolar disorder on the “info” sheet.

How would the author respond to studies that indicate fundamental differences in brain chemistry found in individuals with bipolar disorder? The research is there. How could you stare at two different brain scans and just say “Well, repentance is still sufficient.”

It’s stuff like this that leads the world to think we’re completely irrational.

5   Rick Frueh    http://judahslion.blogspot.com/
September 6th, 2007 at 4:59 pm

I used to believe no counseling, no drugs. But there are provable serotonin level deficiencies and severe mental disorders. If a person believes he is Hitler, maybe more than counseling is needed.

Boy I wish the world was so much neater so we could just wave the magic wand and “poof”, everything all better.

6   Rick Ianniello    http://rianniello.blogspot.com/
September 6th, 2007 at 5:00 pm

As with so many things with these guys, their real goal is to tear down that which they disagree with. I have seen problems in psychiatry in that some of what is treated as psychological disorder really is a matter of failure to live a disciplined life – but not all as Tautages suggest. And this doesn’t make psychiatry equal to quackery, there are legitimate mental illnesses and sufferers out there (and perhaps in here).

On the other end of the equation, as ODM’s do, they also stop short of the power of God. Their alternative to mental/chemical treatment is self-discipline. Interestingly they don’t suggest that the Kingdom of God may just break into a person’s life to miraculously heal them.

As I have dealt with mental disease (some say I still suffer from it), it seems that all three areas need to be looked at (i.e., mental defect, personal discipline, miracle healing – the later is especially important when dealing with demonic influence). It is often treatment of some combination of all of these that is needed.

7   chris    http://agendalesslove.wordpress.com
September 6th, 2007 at 5:26 pm

How irresponsible!! I’m shocked that they would post such misinformation and quite frankly uneducated drivol.

8   Rick    http://gottabuzz.typepad.com/coffee
September 6th, 2007 at 5:41 pm

Just to “apologize” for Slice (they don’t need it, I’m sure), Pastor Ken reported earlier today that the site was down for technical problems. As an IT guy, I know what a pain in the rear that is, drugs or no drugs. So I don’t think it’s Ingrid taking her ball and going home – giving benefit of the doubt, I hope it hasn’t come to that.

9   Rick Frueh    http://judahslion.blogspot.com/
September 6th, 2007 at 5:43 pm

Yea Rick, and that is from a guy whose blog captures you for five seconds when you enter. I suspect a Vulcan mind meld!

10   Russ N.    http://russ-ramblings.blogspot.com
September 6th, 2007 at 6:03 pm

I’ve got two children with special needs. One is taking medication for the ADHD. I think the mind set that Paul T. wrote about goes much farther into Christendom than just the ODMs….I’ve read several articles over the years by syndicated columnists challenging the over-medication and questioning the validity of ADHD diagnoses…

We tried all the good, Christian books and prayed and tried changing diet and prayed and finally went to seek medical assistance. A night and day difference….and we continue to pray.

Both of my kids with special needs are adopted – both of their mothers drank alcohol while pregnant. Both suffer from organic brain damage due to the alcohol. The good, Christian books assume you have a “normal” child that doesn’t have brain damage….their theories completely fall apart for kids with FAS (fetal alcohol syndrome) or FAE (fetal alcohol effects).

It is evidence of living in a fallen world – God may well deliver my kids from their special needs, but I suspect He will work through them for His glory. Both kids have already blown past the dire predictions of what their lives would be like — still certainly not easy (and down-right frustrating most times), but all praise goes to God for doing what He has done in their lives.

11   Sandman    
September 6th, 2007 at 6:43 pm

I use to work for a drug company. It seems to me we’re composed of mind body and spirit. No one seems to get too uptight about going to your MD or DO, or taking drugs for a physical ailment; so why do some people’s head begin to spin when people choose psychiatry, inexact though it may be, as an option for treatment? Granted there are bad docs in every field of medicine, but I wouldn’t throw out mental health treatment that follows Godly principles.

12   Rick    http://gottabuzz.typepad.com/coffee
September 6th, 2007 at 8:04 pm

Hey, Rick F – naah, not “captured” :) – just enthralled and appalled, all at the same time. Amazed and amused. Something like that. I just feel that giving the benefit of the doubt where none is given in return is the right thing to do.

13   Scotty    http://scottysplace-scotty.blogspot.com/
September 6th, 2007 at 8:42 pm

As an old combat soldier that suffers with P.T.S.D (Post Traumatic Stress Disorder), I found that most churches and many of the “christian” counselors are woefully inadequate at dealing with P.T.S.D. I can’t begin to tell you how many hands I had laid on me, prayed over and about, the real issues of it were never dealt with.

It’s a cruel affliction, often times one never knows they have it, let alone that there is a name for the thing. No one ever recognized it in me until a mere 8 years ago, having dealt with it since 1970 not knowing what it was or knowing the signs of it.

I’ve taken a LOT of heat from well meaning christian brothers and sister because I am under counseling and at times I do require drugs. If they only knew the damage that they do! And, that I don’t go christian counselors but, that I go to the Veterans Administration, who were initially slow to react to the issues of P.T.S.D but now have a state or the art program in force now.

Folks with P.T.S.D deal with enough issues of guilt without some well meaning person adding more to that guilt. These folks need to look from the other side of the fence.

14   Ken Silva    http://www.apprising.org
September 6th, 2007 at 8:45 pm

“I don’t think it’s Ingrid taking her ball and going home…”

Not to worry boyz. I spoke with her on the phone and it was a technical glitch at the web host site. Slice should be bacl online in a few hours now.

15   sandy    
September 6th, 2007 at 9:22 pm

Celebrate Recovery was a great catalyst in saving my marriage. I could write a whole essay. I can’t say enough good things. We had about a 100 people come to Christ in one church through our CR program. Our thrid (and last, I should mention) child has the initials CR. Meant that much to us.

16   Chris L    http://www.fishingtheabyss.com/
September 7th, 2007 at 4:08 pm

Washington Post

Warnings from federal regulators four years ago that antidepressants were increasing the risk of suicidal behavior among young people led to a precipitous drop in the use of the drugs. Now a new study has found that the drop coincides with an unprecedented increase in the number of suicides among children.

One Trackback/Ping

  1. CRN.Info and Analysis » An Improved Slice    Sep 07 2007 / 10am:

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