2006
Nov 30

Source: Fishing the Abyss
Comments: A number of commenters on Slice, within a short period of time, denigrated missional work being done to help the poor, both inside and outside the US by dismissively (mis)using Jesus’ commenting that “we’ll always have the poor.” In the process of doing so, these commenters give Jesus’ words the exact opposite of their import. Chris posts a contextual exegesis on the actual meaning of this synoptic passage.
Memorable Quotes:

So, if it wasn’t obvious from the P’shat, the Remez should not only put the lie to those who misuse Jesus’ words, but show us, once again, that - while the eternal destination is not unimportant - our temporal responsibility is to care for both the physical and spiritual needs of those less fortunate.

The Lesser of Two Evils?

Posted by Sliced on Nov 29th, 2006
2006
Nov 29

Source: Verum Serum

Comments: Scott responds to Slice’s current obsession with Barak Obama speaking at Saddleback (on a weekday with a large number of other speakers across the political spectrum) on the subject of AIDS for Saddleback’s Global Summit on AIDS and the Church.  He pulls no punches repudiating a number of Obama’s political position, but also disputes Slice’s borderline hysterical calls for a pastor from a church to which they don’t belong in a denomination of which they don’t belong in a city they don’t live in to do their bidding.
Memorable Quotes:

I’m not talking about compromising what we stand for and selling out our beliefs as Christians in order to “get along” with society. I’m talking about recognizing that at times, though our faith can and should infuse everything we say and do as Christians, it doesn’t mean that we should withdraw from and/or refuse to participate in the process of living in this world or from working along side others as we do so. The process of being the salt and light of this world necessitates interacting with the world on a daily basis…in work and play, in buying and selling, in meeting the needs of society and fighting against social ills and injustice. It is ALL covered by our faith. Our commitment to the Lord and how we live our lives as Christians on a day-to-day basis is how the rest of the world can see Christ.

In the same way, abortion is a crime and is evil on every level…morally, civilly, spiritually, socially, psychologically. It’s wrong all the way around. It doesn’t matter to me if the people fighting along side me to stop abortion are doing it for spiritual, moral, or social reasons. It is important that it stop. Period. Where they stand on other issues is important to me, but it won’t stop me from accepting their help (or from offering mine) in the battle to stop the murder of the unborn.

Satan Smiles on Slice

Posted by Sliced on Nov 29th, 2006
2006
Nov 29

Source: Verum Serum

Comments: John comments on the ongoing hysteria with Slice and some other watchbloggers who are having conniption fits over Rick Warren’s visit to Syria. While he agrees that Warren’s visit was ill-advised, he notes the wild gloating tone Ingrid has taken on with her possibly being mentioned in a letter from Rick Warren which refutes four watchblogs - with Slice presumably one of the four.
Memorable Quotes:

[From Warren's Letter] We are in a spiritual battle for the lives of billions, so we expect opposition. The Bible tells us that “Satan is the accuser of the brethren.” Unfortunately, sometimes Christians do Satan’s job for him. They accuse and criticize other believers. I’m sure that makes Satan smile. [emphasis John's]

Clearly Mr. Farah’s site counts as one of the four “bloggers”, but I have to suspect Slice was another. Why? Because Ingrid issued a press release on this faster than you can say “God-centered theology.” It was one of Google’s top search results on Warren’s trip within a day of being issued.

With that sort of savvy marketing (something Ingrid is against in the church ironically), things are booming in the brethren-bashing sector.

Warren’s letter of explanation is probably as ill-advised as his trip. Sure he’s being treated unfairly and has every right to do some damage control, but acknowledging Slice and — worst of all — letting them know that they do indeed have the ability to irritate him will only make matters worse. And to be fair, the name calling is beneath him. At least he acknowledged that these are fellow believers attacking him. That small grace keeps him one step above the Slice crew.

Ingrid is riding high and, differences aside, you have to feel good for her. She’s worked so hard to become Warren’s online nemesis and here at last is her moment in the sun.

My heart is sad - courtesy of Slice of Laodicea

Posted by Sliced on Nov 29th, 2006
2006
Nov 29

Source: The Todd Blog
Comments: Todd has a rough first introduction to Slice of Laodicea, learning that Fred Phelps’ brand of Christianity wears many faces, courtesy of folks like the ones on Slice. The commenter even had time to misuse a number of scriptures, including “you will always have the poor among you.”
Memorable Quotes:

[The quote that made him sad] “Sure, we as Christian individuals are do our part in showing compassion to the hurting for that is the Spirit of God working in us. But that is not the commission of the church. It is to preach the Gospel, not cure AIDS or what ever else comes along. In while delivering the Gospel we come across someone with AIDS , yes , we are to help. But as Jesus said, let the dead bury the dead. You will always have the poor among you. Jesus did not see a vision of eradicating suffering at least not in a practical way. He saw it in salvation and the promise of an afterlife of a sufferingless existance. Our suffering is to draw us to Him. If that is the case, then for those that would come to Him , suffering is a blessing in disguise. For what truly matters is our soul, not our present bodies. For unless one repents , they will all likewise perish.”

2006
Nov 28

Source: Emerging Thought in Montana

Comments: Iggy notes that eventually someone would track down the truth behind the lies Ken likes to spread against Rob Bell, this time in regards to the growth of Mars Hill Bible Church.
Memorable Quotes:

I said a while back that the accusation against Rob Bell by Ken Silva, (he has posted on one of my comments so you can follow his link there) would come to light in what really is going on in the book… I did not think it was the big coverup/lie/deception/conspiracy/satanic plot… Or whatever insane labeling would or could be attached to it by the self appointed judges of the brethren. I was right.

Source: Fishing the Abyss
Comments: Ken Silva tries to get maximum mileage out of distorting Rob Bell’s description of the growth of Mars Hill Church. Chris demonstrates that not only is Ken far from the truth, but also as obsessive as the literary Ahab, with Rob Bell as his Moby Dick…
Memorable Quotes:

Apparently, having run out of direct material to misquote, Ken has now sunk to digging through comments in Amazon’s book reviews to try and dig up trash on Rob Bell.

So, once again, Slice of Laodicea claims its prize in the Christian blogosphere’s hell on earth. I’d call it the National Enquirer of the Christian tin-foil hat crowd, but I’d be afraid of the Enquirer suing me for defamation.

[Ken's only Reply] Absolutely amazing. You seriously need to consider becoming a spin doctor.

[Henry Frueh, commenting] To say that dealing with the numbers at Mars Hill is ridiculous is an understatement. If a person has an issue with Bell it should be exclusively about his teaching, not the number of people that attend and how they may have or may not have stretched the numbers. But this is an example of how difficult it is to get consumed with being a watchdog, and maintaining a strict firewall between doctine and personal attacks.

Can a Blog Make a Jackass Out of Itself?!?

Posted by Sliced on Nov 16th, 2006
2006
Nov 16

Source: Verum Serum

Comments: Scott takes note of Ingrid’s injection of herself and her tinfoil-hat theories into the news story of Rick Warren travelling to Syria. He documents her increasing hysteria, along with her ‘Amen-Chorus’ of commenters (since the beginning of the Rick Warren and Ted Haggard flaps, she has set the wolves free from their brief imprisonment) who are JUST SURE that Mr. Warren is in league with Satan, possibly as the False Prophet of Revelation.
Memorable Quotes:

I think that it is safe to say that Slice of Laodicea, one of the most virulent and vitriolic blogs in the blogosphere, hates Rick Warren and others “of his kind.” They can’t stand his style of teaching and preaching, they think that his books are spiritual garbage that shouldn’t be read by anyone, and they believe that he waters down the gospel and/or mistreats the Gospel message entirely. Many in Slice’s corner also believe that Mr. Warren is a “wolf in sheep’s clothing,” a deceiver and a tool of Darkness being used to mislead the masses and take them down the highway to Hell.

I guess we should ignore the fact that Mr. Warren didn’t actually say anything about spreading Syria’s propaganda about its image to the world, nor did he say anything about 80% of the U.S. population being against the war. Since Ingrid heard it and wanted to believe it (because it fits with her hatred of Rick Warren), it was worth reporting. That’s some mighty fine news work, Ingrid! Way to go!

To summarize this wise group of individuals, Rick Warren: is obviously in league with and/or a tool of the Deceiver (the Devil); is part of the coming “global deception” (the one world government, one world religion, anti-Christ controlled, pre/mid/post tribulation world); is a False Prophet and is a child of the Devil; is possibly the Antichrist himself or at least has a strong resemblance to He Who Shall Not Be Named.

[Scott commenting] I agree that Ingrid is way out of line, and it really freaks me out that she has taken her vendetta against Warren into the secular arena and has tried to present her spiritual take on the situation to secular news organizations that could/may/will twist what she says just as easily as the Syrian government did with Warren’s statements. She is blinded by her obsession with the Emergent Church, and she and Ken and Chris P. and others are bound and determined to pursue their elusive “great white whale,” even if it injures, damages and even kills them and everyone else they have taken along for the ride.

Investigating Emergent and Contemplative in the SBC

Posted by Sliced on Nov 14th, 2006
2006
Nov 14

Source: Emergent What?

Comments: In one of the exchanges which provided the spark to create this site, Chris emailed Mr. Jim Shull of Lifeway Books to give him a perspective on Ken Silva, who had been harrassing Mr. Shull to pull books from Lifeway’s virtual shelves.
Memorable Quotes:

Dear Mr. Shull,

I read a post yesterday about your correspondence with Mr. Ken Silva, and I wanted to thank you for your decision to disregard his advice regarding censorship of items within your stores. Should he continue to pester you, here are some things you should know about him that will assist you in evaluating further complaints.

1) He wrote to you “As an ordained SBC minister and pastor of Connecticut River Baptist Church (SBC), as well as president of its internet outreach Apprising Ministries…” Ken is very fond of titles - belittling those who disagree with him because he is a pastor (though he has no problem playing plank-speck with other pastors). To be clear, the Connecticut River Baptist Church is a home church which is smaller than the average home Bible Study, and “president of its internet outreach” would be better termed “I’m the only member of my Bible Study with a blog”.

2) Ken also wrote to you “By way of further introduction I also serve as pastoral advisor and contributor to the website Slice of Laodicea as well as being a featured columnist for Christian Worldview Network so I do represent a bit of readership.” To be clear, “Slice of Laodicea” is a ‘watchblog’ site which has little good to say about anything in Christianity today and that perversely revels in the misfortunes, whether accidental (like with Kyle Lake’s electrocution in 2005) or brought on by personal sin (a la Ted Haggard), of other Christians. They are the bottom feeders of the ‘Christian’ blogosphere. Size of readership aside, I doubt these folks would be buying much from your company regardless of whether you censored things to their tastes or not.

3) Ken tells you that “After intense personal study of the Emergent Church and its core doctrine of Contemplative Spirituality (aka Spiritual Formation) for this past year…” trying to establish credibility in the subject. However, as you can see documented here here and other links I could provide you, Ken is unable to actually defend any of his positions when challenged, resorting to patronizing behavoir and smart-alec responses. Recently, when pressed, he wrote that God told him he needed to expose Rob Bell and the emergent church as wolves in sheeps clothing (read his comments in this article, if you wish to see). I don’t know what your background is, but at least in mine, if someone claims to be doing ‘God’s work’, but chooses sinful methods to do so, that tends to discredit whatever calling they claim…

4) Finally, he signs his letter to you with a scriptural reference of Ezekiel 3:7-14. Ken often puts himself into ‘prophetic’ roles for his readership, often giving the appearance of having Pauline authority to do so. However, he has revealed himself to be the Paul of Acts 7:58, and not one post-Acts 9. Like a tin-pot dictator of a third world country decrying the ‘Great Satan’ of America, Ken has positioned himself against the church of today - which, while not perfect by any means, is still the Bride of Christ.

Thank you again for your negative response to Mr. Silva - were you to listen to him and his ilk, I suspect you wouldn’t be carrying much in your store beyond the 1611 KVJ translated Bible.

Grace & Peace,

Chris Lyons

Why Isn’t It Just SIN?!?

Posted by Sliced on Nov 7th, 2006
2006
Nov 7

Source: Verum Serum

Comments: Scott weighs in on the current obsession at Slice - their triumph in the fall of Ted Haggard and its “obvious” roots in the faulty theology of the Seeker-Sensitive movement and American Evangelicalism. He asks the obvious question a number of folks have asked - Why isn’t Haggard’s problem just SIN, and not some high-level “rot” decried by the heretic hunters of the watchblogosphere?
Memorable Quotes:

BUT why isn’t what happened with Ted Haggard just SIN? Why is his SIN somehow bigger and/or badder and/or more important? Why is it that in the minds of these people HIS sin is greater than THEIR sin? Now I know that they will fold their hands and piously drone on about the “higher calling and standards” applied to leaders in the church, but they are missing out on the fact that the Bible NEVER says that the sin of any man or woman is greater than the sin of another, or deserving of greater attention or greater condemnation or greater judgment.

So King David, the King that God chose to lead Israel, sinned and sinned in a MAJOR way. But his sin didn’t seem to preclude him from God’s mercy and grace. The Scripture certainly makes clear that what he did was sinful and wrong and that he was PUNISHED for it (rightly so). But we’re never shown that David’s sin was evidence of a wrong set of beliefs or teachings. We are shown that David’s sin was a result of his sinful nature, of the desires he harbored in his heart that ran against what God wanted for him.

Again, where’s the fun in that? I mean, if we can’t claim that Ted Haggard’s sin is an indictment of a whole organization or movement, then the only thing left to do is to look to the sin in our own house (so to speak). And again, where’s the fun in that?

Though they will claim that there is no joy in Muddville over this sad, unseemly story, I can’t help but notice an undercurrent of pride and an attempt at masking some small amount of excitement at seeing their narrow-minded-tunnel-visioned-pharisaical views somehow possibly validated by the fall of this pastor.

So Tim Brown (the gadfly himself) has decided that the millions of people who would identify themselves as Evangelical Christians don’t “care one whit about holiness or obedience to God’s Word,” and all because of Ted Haggard’s sin? I wonder if this guy hangs out with the “Reverend” Ken Silva, ‘cause they certainly seem to paint things (and people) with the same REALLY, REALLY broad brush.

By the way, thanks for judging my Christianity which, by its very nature is contemporary because I am a Christian living my faith in the present (or contemporary) culture. Perhaps you aren’t aware of it, but Luther’s faith was contemporary, too, as was Calvin’s.

Please catch a clue. Thanks!

Of course, Ingrid over at Slice has to jump into the mix. In this case, she has determined that Ted Haggard has “shattered the reputations of millions of undeserving faithful Christians.” I think that Ingrid, at this point, is playing for the cameras (so to speak) because “shattered” is a pretty heavy word to use. I know that it serves her purpose because by claiming the whole “shattered” thing, she can point to how right she has been in her long fight against all of the evil in the church and how Haggard’s sin is evidence of the damage that can happen when people don’t listen to her and people like her.

Ted Haggard: Nailed to the Gate

Posted by Sliced on Nov 6th, 2006
2006
Nov 6

Source: Verum Serum

Comments: John takes on the feeding frenzy in the watchblogosphere which seeks to make Ted Haggard’s failing into a poster child for bad theology.  Through some examination of scripture and noting some more mature responses, John (once again) puts Ken, Ingrid and company into place.
Memorable Quotes:

For example, Ingrid at Slice of Laodicea wrote an article about the scandal which not surprisingly condemns pretty much every living evangelical. She wrote:

Evangelicalism is where medieval Roman Catholicism was just before that portentous day when Dr. Luther pounded his Theses to the castle church door at Wittenburg.

Ingrid’s fellow Slice author Ken Silva promoted a post by The Reformed Gadfly which ends:

Stuff like this can only happen because contemporary Christianity is rotten to the core.

Tim Challies, who is as reformed as anyone and with whom I’ve disagreed on occasion, has an excellent post which doesn’t devolve into the “I told you so!” mold. On the contrary, he takes on some of the other bloggers mentioned above.

Jesus was pretty clear about the response we should have to this sort of sin. When the Pharisees brought a woman caught in the act of adultery before him, he turned the question around on them. In essence what he said was: Look at yourself. He said much the same thing in a parable about a Pharisee who prayed “God, I thank you that I am not like other men…” The pharisees’ eye is always on someone else, never on himself.

So I’d like to suggest that the Haggard mess provides us with an interesting insight into where some people stand. Bloggers whose response to Ted Haggard is to look for the rot in someone else (all evangelicals, all mega-church pastors, etc.) have missed the point. Look at yourself. And if, after doing so, you’re still eager to condemn someone, well…you’re either a saint or liar. And there are very few saints.

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