CRN.Info and Analysis

Source: Bob Blog

Comments: After noting Ingrid’s habit of using his blog for research, Bob posts a hilarious parody from LarkNews, based on Ingrid’s hyperbole.

Memorable Quotes:

Ingrid shows her true spiritual gift by making a prophecy: “It’s only a matter of time before we see church naming rights being purchased by companies. How about Cool Ranch Doritos Baptist Church? Or Bud Light Assemblies of God. Don’t laugh. It’s coming.”

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[comment by blind beggar] Some would say Slice of Laodicea is very much like the tabloids you mentioned (”The Sun” and “National Enquirer”). Certainly not me, but some would ;-).

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Source: Fishing the Abyss
Comments: A number of commenters on Slice (including some of the writers) frequently (mis)use Jesus’ anger in the Temple as an excuse for their boorish behavior.  Here, Chris examines this event in Jesus’ life, using remez and contextual interpretation of the scripture to give a more accurate picture of what was going on in the Temple, and why Jesus was so upset with the goings on…

Source: Fishing the Abyss
Comments: Another oft-misused set of scriptures by the Slice crowd is that of Jesus’ warnings of persecution. Using these, a number of Slice commenters sniff at any Christian figure (besides Johnny Mac) with all that much of a following of obviously ’selling out’, because they’re not being persecuted. In this post, Christ shreds this notion.

The comments on this particular post drag on for a good while, as Ken chose this thread to offer one of his ominous veiled ‘pastoral threats’ (for removing one of his favorite canards).

Memorable Quotes:

And thus, the implication is that people agree with Person A, and therefore he is a false prophet. Additionally, since Person A is not being persecuted, he is therefore not a servant of the Master. Game, set and match - no need for further discussion. Person B can declare victory and assume any further conversation on the topic is divisiveness, and that Person A is to be avoided (often citing Titus 3:10, just to complete the scriptural abuse trifecta).

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["Pastor" Ken Silva] I sincerely do pray that one day the Lord will help you to be able to see yourself more clearly that you might recognize what you are actually doing.

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[Zan, in response to Ken] Which one of your blindspots have you projected onto Chris?

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[Chris, to Ken] After today’s article on Rob Bell, you might want to re-read the definition of ’straw man’. You created enough of them to defend a small third world country, if only they could fight (but I guess that defeats the purpose, doesn’t it?)

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[Chris, to Ken]

At first blush, I counted 5 ’straw men’ before I got all that far into the article. So, you want data? Let’s just go to one of the first ones. You said:

Let me also say that Rob Bell does state he affirms “the historic Christian faith,” which he then defines vaguely. Bell postulates, “But if the whole faith falls apart when we reexamine and rethink one spring, then it wasn’t that strong in the first place, was it?” The problem we immediately confront is that in the postmodern mindset nothing can be stated absolutely which then rules out a priori something being strong in the first place.

Funny thing, you just put words in Bell’s mouth that were NEVER there, and then you proceeded to tear the words he never said apart. Classic logical ’straw man’ fallicy. I could go on, but your articles are so easy to deconstruct and show false that I don’t have to put any words in your mouth, since you do it yourself…

And Ken, you do “call” yourself a pastor-teacher, and perhaps you act in that capacity in the real world, but nobody made you the pastor-teacher of the internet. If that’s all it takes, then I could call myself one, as well, and I don’t even need a piece of paper on my wall… As your discussion this evening has shown, though, you’re just not able to answer anyone’s questions/criticisms with any level of aplom that one would expect from a ‘pastor-teacher’ - even one wet behind the ears and fresh out of school.

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Source: Evangelical Outpost (filed under ‘Religion’)

Comments: Joe Carter takes on the position of Ingrid (of the “Holier-Than-Thou Slice of Laodicea”) on the proper dress for church.
Memorable Quotes:

It’s always amusing when people take their preferred cultural norms and translate that into, “Thus saith the Lord.” I don’t know Ingrid but from the photo on her website, she doesn’t appear to dress like an Amish milkmaid. So I can imagine that any 16th century Puritan who saw the way she dresses would chastise her just as harshly for clothing herself “like a harlot.” Of course she would defend herself by telling the dour Puritan that she shouldn’t be judged by his time bound, anachronistic standard of appropriate attire. She would claim that she should be bound by the norms of her own culture, which just happens to be the secular, pagan ideal of “appropriateness” for white, middle-class women. [emphasis his]

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Source: Bob Blog

Comments: Bob is named the editor of Next Wave, resulting in a post on Slice where he learns of his actual eternal destination - in the first posted response! (Ask anyone on Slice, and they’ll tell you where you’re going - why even wait for God?). He mentions his surprise at this in a summary update.

Memorable Quotes:

I’m just gobsmacked at the discussion over on Slice. 46+ comments later on a little throw-away article about me being named editor of Next Wave. These people continue to embody the Dilbertian ethic of “You may commence misunderstanding me and attacking that misunderstanding now!”

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Source: Bob Blog
Comments: Bob Hyatt notes that it took only 3 or 4 seconds to be named a Heretic on Slice after his Next-Wave editorship was announced there.
Memorable Quotes:

Personal note: Mom, whatever you do, do not click that link, and do not under any circumstances leave a comment!! Seriously!

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Source: Fishing the Abyss

Comments: The ‘Reverend’ Ken Silva posted an open letter to his supporters, denigrating them for not giving enough and begging for money to allow him to attack legitimate Christian ministries full time. In response, Chris posted a parable comparing those who seek to serve others and those who seek to tear down the church, and how God honors them.

Memorable Quotes:

Ben said, ‘I have taken care of this small farm, just like you asked me to. I also went out across the countryside, decrying the farming techniques Bob was using. He was using machines to till the soil, and not his hands, and he was wasting his time giving food to the poor and water to the thirsty instead of farming the way that is right in my eyes. I would have done more, O King, but I did not have the funds to do so. Why did you not give me more?’

And the king answered, ‘Why would I give you more money to prevent food from being grown and harvested? Have you not already done enough damage?’

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[brendt comments] You miss the point entirely. Decrying Bob is a ministry.

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Source: Tall Skinny Kiwi

Comments: After Ingrid informed us all how we need to dress for church, Andrew, the Tall Skinny Kiwi, writes an excellent piece showing how ludicrous such legalistic clap-trap really is…
Memorable Quotes:

The question of what Jesus would wear has been chewed over in many emerging church circles, but no absolute certainty has been achieved. We do know he was given his one-piece garment and it was a QUALITY item, fought over at his death.

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A good description of “pagan” in found in the Bible.
Jesus said “And why do you worry about clothes? See how the flowers of the field grow. They do not labor or spin. Yet I tell you that not even Solomon in all his splendor was dressed like one of these. If that is how God clothes the grass of the field, which is here today and tomorrow is thrown into the fire, will he not much more clothe you—you of little faith? So do not worry, saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ or ‘What shall we drink?’ or ‘What shall we wear?’ For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them. But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well. Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.” Matthew 6:28-35

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A site named Slice of Laodicea had a recent post on pagan dress and blue mohawks, like those found in those “emergent” churches. In case you were wondering, my son’s blue mohawk has been replaced with a basic hairstyle - yes, its red - but its very simple.

Nothing pagan about dying your hair - otherwise half the senior citizens in my old church need to repent!

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Source: Musings from Two-Sheds Gomer

Comments: Brendt writes about Mark Driscoll’s speaking appearance at John Piper’s desiring God conference, and Steve Camp’s ungenerous response to the appearance.
Memorable Quotes:

Driscoll had to leave shortly after his message, and so he wasn’t present when Dr Piper later issued a caution to him (and, ostensibly, those like him). This absolutely set the blogosphere on fire as Driscoll-supporters wondered aloud about Piper’s method and venue and Driscoll-bashers smugly gave the Sunday-school equivalent of “Nyah, nyah. Told you so.” Case in point from one commenter:

Many of us who were concerned about Piper having Driscoll in at this conference, it now sounds like those concerns were justified . . .

Well no, Steve, actually they weren’t even close to being justified. Not only did Driscoll take the admonishment in the spirit in which it was intended, but when Piper found out that some online might read way too much into the situation, he encouraged Driscoll to make it clear that he (Piper):

. . . would not have .001 seconds hesitation in having Mark Driscoll come back tomorrow to our church or our conference.

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Source: Verum Serum

Comments: Here, Scott dissects the Slice (in particular Ingrid) view of music within the church.  This is probably one of the best articles on this subject, as well.  The comments (there’s almost 100) meander a bit, but also end up drawing Ken and Chris P. into the fray, as well.
Memorable Quotes:

Going back over the last couple months, Ingrid and her peeps have thrown up many posts that reference music in one way or another. Most, if not all, of these slam contemporary music and worship styles in favor of the “good old music” of hymns (and hymns pre-1850 seem to be their songs of choice). Ingrid typically makes a statement like this:

When I hear of churches comprised of Christians with mohawks, body piercings, and worship music that sounds like a rehearsal for hell, I am concerned.”

Or this:

This music is hatched in hell itself. It is the sound of spiritual revolt against all that is holy and true. It is spiritual rebellion against God.

Or this (in reference to the worship leader at Saddleback Chruch):

What does it take to be a “top worship leader”? Does it mean that your congregation has the coolest worship moves? Does it mean you have the biggest attendance, the best riffs on the guitar? The best bump and grind moves up there with the house worship band? The hottest selling CD or the most downloads on the web? … There are no band leaders mentioned, no jiggly females, no writhing and twitching and no screaming audience members throwing their fannies and their arms around.

Call me crazy, but I’m guessing that any music that wasn’t composed for a church organ makes Ingrid nervous. Or perhaps she has forgotten that at some point, even the church organ was viewed as the “worldly interloper” into the sanctity of the church.

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Deceptively, SLICE throws up the occasional example of the ridiculous (such as their recent posts regarding Showbread and Zombie Gutz) in an effort to portray most/all contemporary Christian singers/song writers as shallow, brain-dead morons with little or no talent. Ingrid points to the fringe in an attempt to condemn the entire genre. And of course, as always Ingrid and her SLICE-posse use this fringe (which are admittedly sad, lame, and even dimwitted) in an attempt to draw some sort of connection to the Seeker Sensitive/Emergent Church and movements.

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Christ the Lord is Risen Today was written in 1739 by Charles Wesley when he was 32 yrs old. He wrote this hymn in celebration of the first service held in London’s first Wesleyan Chapel. This chapel was also known as the Foundry Meeting House, because it was created out of an abandoned foundry and metal works. Wesley purchased the building to house his growing number of converts to the Christian faith. Many in the “establishment” objected to his use of such a “worldly” building for the purposes of God, but he proceeded with his plans anyway.

(Interesting that the SLICE peeps don’t have a problem with a foundry being converted to a church, but they sure do take exception to a movie theater being used for the same purpose.)

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One last time…by the SLICE standard, Isaac Watts would have missed the mark. He was young, advocated the personalization of the worship experience, advocated a departure from the traditional forms of worship (the Psalms), was denounced by church leaders on both sides of the ocean, and was the cause for church splits rooted in the controversial and radical use of his new ideas.

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[Chris L. commenting] The article you linked to is another one that just follows Ken’s current kick of using “letters” from “other people” to try and make his points (since he has been woefully short of any new anti-Bell material, of late). Apparently quoting dead theologians is no longer as “convincing” as quoting nameless letter-writers. (When he actually named a writer earlier this year, he was embarrassed when the living, named person criticized him for taking his words out of context.)

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[Chris L. commenting]  Laz writes:

so you don’t agree with her that there might be (however minute) anger and hatred towards Bell in your theses?

I guess the better question would be, is there love in your rebukes?

Ken writes back:

Laz,

We’ll have to let the Lord be the judge of that but thanks for your feigned concern.

And to answer your question: I am expressing the same love for Bell’s doctrine as expressed by John the Baptist here:

[contextually abused/misused KJV quote omitted]
[emphasis mine]

And so it is that Ken automagically makes an ad homenim attack on Laz, assuming that his concern is a false one.

I went and checked out Laz’ blog, and I would hazard a guess from the posts (and Slice on the blogroll) that Laz might agree with Ken some of the time, and that his concern was probably real.

I guess when you’re a misguided pit bull, you’ll bite the friendlies along with everyone else.

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[Reposted comment from Slice] This posting and most of the comments thereafter are a perfect microcosm of this website. It is very difficult to argue with this kind of logic:

“I know what the scripture says and how to interpret portions that others disagree about or struggle with. God has told ME clearly what is right and wrong. The Holy Spirit has revealed to ME what is truth and heresy. Anyone who disagrees with ME (because God has told ME these things) is therefore in disagreement with God.

“No one has a more revealed, truthful perspective than ME, and if anyone disagrees with ME then they are obviously disagreeing with God. Knowledge of Truth is only obtained through methods I know about and agree with and if I disagree with your methods, it must be because God disagrees with them. God’s logic is perfectly understandable to me; it has become my own logic.

“God spoke to certain historical men clearly and completely, but He does not speak to other men clearly or completely today, unless they are men whose perspectives agree with ME. I read the Bible literally except where God has revealed deeper meaning to ME.

“If you are a person with whom I generally disagree or if you are associated with another person or movement whom I have already deemed to be heretical, then I will examine your statements and tell you what you mean, even if my interpretation was not your intended meaning. If we disagree, I will not give you an opportunity to answer questions, but instead I will immediately begin proclaiming your heresy from the highest rooftops. I know what you mean better than even you know what you mean, because God has revealed this all to ME.

“If you and I disagree, I am obviously right because I know God better than you know God. I know God’s nature, methods, and Spirit better than you know those things. God has given ME and those who agree with ME the ultimate discernment to pronounce Truth and denounce heresy. I will quote Scripture and tell everyone if God has shown me your interpretation of the same Scripture is incorrect.

“I will make generalizations about people and groups because God has revealed to ME their true natures. I will see the motives of people’s hearts just as God sees those motives, and I will tell everyone what I see. Perhaps you do not even know your own secret motives or deceptions, but I can see them and I will reveal them to you because God has revealed them to ME.

“I will be the champion of the faith and preserve the traditions that God has shown ME to be correct.

“Do not disagree with anything I have said, because the Bible is MY final authority and if you argue with ME, you are disregarding the Bible’s authority and are, therefore, a heretic.

“You are obviously not correct, but I AM.”

[ASIDE: Is this not the ultimate pride? If I hold these inflexible views, do they not place me in violation of Commandment #1? Perhaps having no other God before God does not include the God of SELF, when I proclaim that my own understanding, logic, and truth are those of God himself?]

“If you post something on my website which disagrees with ME or anyone with whom I agree, I will delete it as God has labeled it a dissention among our bretheren.”

I guess we’ll see how long this stays posted.

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